SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I don't need to pile on as there will be more coming your way.

Dude, just read DeceivedInDetroit latest post, read and learn how a BS should act. SMH...

Now all of a sudden, she wants me to wear coveralls during sex!

AP is not vaxxed so cannot go to the bars.

I'm starting to believe SpaceGhost is correct. The "coveralls during sex" bit was already stretching my credulity. But the statement that really made me question is the second statement re: AP not being vaxxed. "Give her enough rope to hang herself" .... WTF. The health of your unvaccinated children is at stake here. If Reddy really is the caring parent he paints himself to be NO WAY would he allow his W to bump and grind with an unvaccinated AP. I'm out.

[This message edited by BoundaryBuilder at 5:11 AM, Monday, September 27th]

Sadly the only creative writing exercise her is, as my wife claims, her text transcript with AP.

The coveralls bit is 100% true and frankly, I couldn't believe it either. The brazenness of it as she knows I read her texts.

I should clarify one thing about MC. We both had individual sessions that week with me going first on the Wednesday. During that session I indicated to the MC that I was done with the marriage. So, I would gather that the operating assumption of my wife's session, which followed on Friday, was that I was out. In which case, I guess I could see the MC saying that she could remain in contact with AP as there would really be no reason to cut him out if divorce were inevitable. Given the change in circumstances, however, I will not tolerate communication with him.

My wife keeps painting me as the sneaky controlling one because I have spyware on her phone and am intercepting her text messaging. I told her that I was very unhappy with her contacting him, but that I would no longer control her life. I am getting to a place of indifference. Part of me also, I guess, just wants that smoking gun too. Hence the rope to hang herself with. I probably shouldn't be so hung up on proving her bullshit, but I just can't seem to get it out of my head.

As for the vax, we all had COVID back in May. My daughter brought it home from school and everyone of us tested positive for it. My wife and my oldest, almost 12, were hit hardest and were sick for about two weeks. Youngest (4) tested positive but showed no symptoms and my daughter had nothing more than a runny nose. I was sick for two days with very minor symptoms. Really wasn't a big deal, at least at our household. In fact, my reaction to the first dose of the vax was severe and left me non-functional for about four days and had some major chest pains that scared the ever loving shit out of me, far worse than the actual virus.

Anyway, thanks for the reality check. I know many are getting mad seeing me do this to myself, and frankly I am too. I thought maybe I could make something work with her, but I just can't. I still haven't told her I know about her letter to AP. I am kind of interested in his response. I know that so far he has refused to answer any of her texts and she has communicated to her friends "does this mean it's all over"? Hopefully, after all this, she will have lost both me and AP.

Nothing will change if you change nothing.

You can make this stop, so get with your lawyer and get things done ASAP!

Don’t think that your kids will be better off if you stay…your kids will be better off with at least one mature and emotionally healthy parent, hopefully that will be you.

This is one of the stories that is really hard to read. OP is surrounded by evil people. OP's wife is a narcissist. WW's friends are all cheaters who gets to enable each other with cheating and gets to brag about it on their discussions. AP claims to be afraid of OP but still gets to enjoy having sex with WW.

It also makes me wonder your OP's thought processing. You clearly know that your WW doesn't really care about you. She cares about being married on the front, not necessarily with you, while enjoying all her side activities with her BFFs and AP. She wants to maintain the facade of being happily married to a safe person, you. And she also wants to enjoy her freedom of enjoying and journaling her sexcapades - with her AP this time. But since she's also with BFF's who brags about enjoying other adventures, I'm pretty sure she won't stop with AP. Pretty sure her bunch of enabler BFF's will have to find another sex partner for her the next time.

Now she knows that you're watching her so she gets to do her activities discreetly, old school method. She gets to drive by her AP for at least a few hours without telling him to or just tell him to drop by a mail - for at least 2 hours. You get the point. Dropping a mail for a couple of hours is just absurd. A lot can happen in those few hours especially when you're dropping by an affair partner who, based on her writing, is a more better sexual partner than her husband.

I know you know your WW better than anybody else in the world. You know who she really is. We only base our judgment based on what you wrote. Please, don't prolong your agony. She won't change. She will keep doing it because she's getting away with. You're letting her get away with it.

Sorry for the rant but I have to get this through you...

Part of me also, I guess, just wants that smoking gun too. Hence the rope to hang herself with. I probably shouldn't be so hung up on proving her bullshit, but I just can't seem to get it out of my head.

You have been given multiple smoking guns in the form of text messages between her and others. You have more evidence of her deceit than most of us ever get. What more do you need? A video of them together? You're not stuck because of a lack of evidence and needing to "prove" it happened. You're stuck because you're choosing to believe there is a chance she is telling the truth when she lies to you and says it never happened.

Reddy, you say you’re looking for a smoking gun, but you already have so many smoking guns in the room that it is clouding your ability to see clearly. What you’ve uncovered is ample reason to D if you want, and you have no reason to offer R yet based on her behavior.

If you need photos of them in the act as your "smoking gun" proof, hire a PI. She couldn’t even stay away from him for a week while "trying" to save her M (she was actually trying to convince you to have an open M, but whatever). You’ll have your evidence sooner than later.

Part of me also, I guess, just wants that smoking gun too

Let's face it. The smoking gun is your way to justify procrastinating and not making the difficult decisions.

Hopefully, after all this, she will have lost both me and AP.

I am not so sure about the above. She may very well lose her AP but it seems she had you on the wing when things aren't working out with the AP. Sad to say you are allowing that to happen.

Apparently, the MC said that my wife was "fairly justified" in having the affair and that she should maintain contact with AP.

This is a lie. Everyone's so quick to jump on the "See, MCs SUCK!" bandwagon, when it's much more likely that your absolutely brazenly ridiculous wife is lying to you.

You do not need any more information. You have what you need to make a decision, you just don't want to make it. I get it. It's hard. If you're not ready to leave, then detach completely from her. No talks, no MC, no nothing except business about the running of the household and the kids.

Both of you in Coveralls? Did she ask you to grow a mustache as well?

So your WW wants an open marriage with the Mario Brothers, I've seen stranger things here. You probably could use a couple of Italian plumbers to exterminate the creatures coming up from your sewer.

Gen X humor aside, it seems like you're letting fear guide your destiny. Fear of the unknown. I get it. One minute you're living in relative comfort and stability, the next...

You're on your own. Divorce is scary. It was scary for me until I talked to an attorney. Talking to an attorney was very empowering and worth every penny.

Please talk to an attorney. An attorney will pave the way and make the process less intimidating. A half way decent lawyer will have a field day with your WW.

No more individual sessions with "Marriage" Counselors crafting a "marriage" of HER design.

I for one am not feeling you are a troll. But I do think you are being irresponsible. There is passive thinking and then there is total passivity in the face of outrageous conduct.

Your wife is doing everything but taking photos and waving them in your face. You say you hate her for it. Your path is simple. Do something. Anything constructive. Fight back. Take your life back. Find your balls and stop laying down for this.

File for heavens sake. What’s it gonna take? Videos displayed in the local supermarket?

Call her bluff. You can always pull back later, if you see her folding and putting in the work. But right now she is laughing in your face and emotionally taunting you.

You must free yourself of fear. Divorce is not going to kill you. She is not going to hire a hit man. She is going to act like most cheaters and go look for greener pastures. Use that to get quick finality.

Can I be any clearer? Women hate weakness. Show her that you are the man she married. No more soulful talks. No more bargaining. No more promises. In the famous words of Phillie mayor Rizzo, you need to make Attila the Hun look like a"………can I say it? It rhymes with maggot.

Reddy,

You wrote, The coveralls bit is 100% true

I can very much believe it, my W started having orgasms from sniffing and licking my smelly underarms. And while it was arousing in a way I wondered who is this person. It didn't last long as I think the OM2 thing ended quickly or she became disgusted with herself.

What more smoking gun do you need? At this point if you walked in on them having sex, you'd believe "It's not what it looks like".

Things came to a head that night after we had both had individual sessions with out marriage counsellor.

You are wasting money by seeing the same counselor separately. And it's ethically questionable for her to do it. Your counselor can't divulge what is said in either of your individual sessions, which makes it useless. You either see the MC together or you get your own IC.

AP responded to her letter and broke it off with her saying that he has been far too involved in the situation already and that it makes him very uncomfortable. He even showed surprising empathy saying that she should "stop waving me in his face, I know how I would feel if this were happening to me, and that's why I'm out".

After that I saw other messages to her friends saying that her "white knight is not coming to save her". LOL.

Last night she told me he had told her that he was done with her and that I should be happy about that. Sure, whatever. I told her I knew about her letter. And her messages. She insists that I am the "white knight" she was referring to and that the letter contained only questions she had about divorce processes since he is divorced and she wanted to know how he went about it.

However, it's clear there was far more to the letter than she lets on considering her messages to her friends (and his message breaking it off). I asked for a copy of her letter. She promised to give it to me.

Today she texts me that she has the letter and can either email it or print it and bring it home. I told her I want the electronic copy of the letter.

When I get the letter I open it and check the file's properties and version history. Sure as shit, she wrote the damned thing this morning (as I expected) and it contains only the information that she admitted to yesterday. Surprise! I wonder how she thought she would get away with such an obvious trick?

Everything is theatre.

Glad you at least have evidence of her continued lies.

Look at that last effort as her final "hell no!" To doing anything to change herself, her behavior, her commitment to you and the marriage.

As I always say, it’s not the affair that kills the marriage it is the behavior after the affair that kills the marriage.

She’s a damn cliche right from the non-existent Cheater’s Manual. She’s just not giving you any props for being one step ahead of her.

[This message edited by The1stWife at 8:34 PM, Tuesday, September 28th]

Everything is theatre.

I think your WW is desperately trying to control the narrative. That's typical, btw. The majority of busted WS will continue to lie, deceive, minimize, deflect, gas-light, and so on and so forth, until they finally fucking realize that they're only digging themselves further into their own graves, so to speak. By that point, for a great many BS, it's too late.

I agree with others that your MC is lacking (to put it kindly). That's typical, too, btw. It seems that the vast majority of therapists and counselors have little to no training or education about infidelity and all that comes with it. Damn shame, too, if you ask me. A course on infidelity "should" be a required course at every college and university (at least for those majoring in psych, etc.).

If you haven't yet done so, check out The Healing Library's articles section. There are two essay's about "Understanding the 180." Print copies and read them every few days. That helped me tremendously.

Focus on you and your recovery, brother. It's critical to helping you make the decisions you're going to have to make (none of which are easy). Take care of yourself, be kind and gentle with yourself. For most folks, the betrayal of infidelity hits like a freight train. It's a powerful shock to the system and severe emotional and psychological trauma. It takes time and focus to pick yourself up off the ground, dust yourself off, and step back up to the plate.

Consult an attorney, asap. Educate yourself on your rights and what a separation or divorce would look like financially. Knowledge is power, you know?

[This message edited by Unhinged at 9:37 PM, Tuesday, September 28th]

Reddy -

I have never in my life seen a person have such a clear cut case of their spouse cheating on them and planning to leave them and evidence that their spouse DGAF about them, and yet want to give WS "the benefit of the doubt" in perpetuity. Lovingly, I’m saying you are insane. My frustration comes from helplessly reading this thread and you unrelentingly punching yourself in the face. I wish I could stop you!!

A typical tactic of a wayward taking the A underground is going analog (the letter) to arrange new ways to communicate (new burner phone, code words to use, new hookup calendar set) and there is a big show to the betrayed that the affair has ended.

She knows you’re monitoring and now AP is breaking it off and her friends are backing that up with vague messages. I don’t believe in coincidences and neat little convenient bows when it comes to affairs.

Monitor actions now, clock absences, moods, how she treats you.

Your WW is one of the most prolific liars I’ve read on SI, you’ve seen how chronic this problem is, she needs help with that alone outside of her whys to cheat. Let’s say the AP did end it (not for a second do I believe it, dude knew she was married during A, that wouldn’t scare him off now) this does not mean her pathological lying problem ends.

Unsafe partner.

Reddy, I wouldn't be so sure that OM is gone for good. He did start the A with her. He's been sleeping with her for X number of months without feeling too guilty. He'll be gone for as long as it takes for her to prove to him that you're separating and totally divorcing while she tells you whatever you want to hear to get you to stick around. Don't wait around to see how long it takes or for her to get a new OM to replace him.